tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3202206756122982360.post1533937226980020199..comments2023-06-11T11:08:59.117-04:00Comments on South From the North Woods: Seventeen MilesJim Rosebrockhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/16265389768045833247noreply@blogger.comBlogger13125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3202206756122982360.post-57668502441348468262020-02-08T16:47:20.453-05:002020-02-08T16:47:20.453-05:00Jim, I too enjoyed reading your excellent route re...Jim, I too enjoyed reading your excellent route retracement study and about your research. You raised great questions and though the truth will not change the result of Hill's participation in the battle it raises the following question in my mind. When did Lt.Brown create his map? If it was towards the end of the war or even afterwards, his recollection of the route may not coincide with reality of those harried hours. Regimental histories from some of the local VA regiments that were in Hill's Light Division may provide the best evidence of the correct(?) route.<br /><br />I enjoy an odd hobby known as wargaming and the designers of games that simulate historical battles run the gamut of excellent to terrible when incorporating the effect of historical moments, like Hill's arrival on the battlefield at right place and time that brought the battle to a close on the 17th. I would place any of the designs by Dean Essig in the excellent category. He developed a gem titled "None But Heroes" that is the best simulation of the Battle of Antietam/Sharpsburg I have played. <br /><br />In fact, the rules he incorporates to reflect the impact of Hill's journey from H.F. to Boteler's are based on the same work by Dr Harsh you reference when questioning Hill's distance traveled. If you have any interest in 'experiencing' what it must have been like to walk in the boots of any of the major 'players' of this historical conflict, and you have the time to invest (this is no game of Monopoly), I highly recommend you purchase Mr. Essig's recreation of America's Bloodiest Day. It recreates ACW warfare on a regimental level and offers you the opportunity to try to improve Lee's or McClellan's performance. <br /><br />It is a game and not a glorification of battle. Your service may have taken you into real combat and thus you may consider such historical recreations a trivialization or whitewashing of a harsh reality. But you seem to interested in the details of the ACW that I believe Dean Essig so painstakingly succeeded in incorporating in his ACW conflict simulation design known as the Line of Battle. You may find them interesting.<br /><br />Thank you for your service,<br />Mark SMark Shttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13359295359223123384noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3202206756122982360.post-46630969298509002682015-09-04T02:25:18.029-04:002015-09-04T02:25:18.029-04:00Everyone seems to go all around the actual fact th...Everyone seems to go all around the actual fact that Hill marched out of Harpers ferry almost 4 miles back to Halltown before turning on west on the Shepardstown Pike,nowWV230. Its is my contention that he left the Shepardstown pike and began his march cross country toward the ford at what is now Uvilla. If you follow this route its is much closer to 17 miles<br />Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03508869839944858688noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3202206756122982360.post-70573943832604173802015-04-18T16:29:09.414-04:002015-04-18T16:29:09.414-04:00Warfare is a fascinating subject. Despite the dubi...Warfare is a fascinating subject. Despite the dubious morality of using violence to achieve personal or political aims. It remains that conflict has been used to do just that throughout recorded history.<br /><br />Your article is very well done, a good read.Geraldhttp://www.greatmilitarybattles.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3202206756122982360.post-28083026296636127072013-05-24T10:06:16.273-04:002013-05-24T10:06:16.273-04:00I live along the route shown above and have casual...I live along the route shown above and have casually researched the route over the years. Although this is not conclusive I believe Trough Road is the road Hill followed. Several years ago a group of Hardcore re-enacters from SC followed Hill's route. I had the chance to speak with them in detail. It was amazing the nitty gritty stuff they knew about this march. In particular one gentlemen seemed to be more informed than the others and he was absolutely sure that Trough road was the authentic route. Moreover Trough road was the better road in those days, more established, wider etc. Finally as you noted it is shorter. <br /><br />WJM <br />Harpers Ferry<br />Occupied VA, USAAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3202206756122982360.post-30319598068283724482010-10-09T20:07:42.488-04:002010-10-09T20:07:42.488-04:00Jim, Great work! I'm very impressed by your re...Jim, Great work! I'm very impressed by your research...keep questioning history! Thanks for your 28 years of Army service to our nation. <br /><br />Sincerely,<br />DaleAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3202206756122982360.post-35567683320886774362009-09-27T07:41:04.710-04:002009-09-27T07:41:04.710-04:00Clark,
I am glad you found the post informational ...Clark,<br />I am glad you found the post informational and inspirational! Enjoy the ride!<br /><br />Regards<br />JimJim Rosebrockhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16265389768045833247noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3202206756122982360.post-46322297428140188862009-09-26T21:20:04.882-04:002009-09-26T21:20:04.882-04:00Jim: I am driving to Harper's Ferry from Shap...Jim: I am driving to Harper's Ferry from Shapsburg tomorrow and will return via Hill's route. Thanks for the inspiration! Today was my first visit to the Antietam battlefield and topography explains EVERYTHING that is unclear even after reading a thorough study like Sears' book. I am looking forward to a similar experience tomorrow as I imagine A. P. Hill's mad rush to the sound of the guns.<br /><br />ClarkAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3202206756122982360.post-73595459687630262009-09-19T00:15:58.017-04:002009-09-19T00:15:58.017-04:00Ed,
Thanks for your comment. I have thought along...Ed,<br />Thanks for your comment. I have thought along the lines of perhaps an inaccurate map as well. There is certainly no detracting his accomplishment of the day and to not only complete a march of whatever distance on a warm and humid day and then launch a powerful attack against the Union flank is certainly what has put Hill in the history books. I agree, it was an admirable accomplishment.<br />Regards<br />JimJim Rosebrockhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16265389768045833247noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3202206756122982360.post-47730793143688803502009-09-18T19:10:36.637-04:002009-09-18T19:10:36.637-04:00I cannot think of any method that General Hill wou...I cannot think of any method that General Hill would have been able to accurately determine the number of miles his troops marched between Harper's Ferry and Sharpsburg other than relying upon a map and my understanding is that maps of that era were not always accurate. The General might have arrived at the distance of seventeen miles by relying upon an inaccurate map or he might have simply made what he thought was an educated guess. Regardless of how much captured rations his troops might have consumed prior to the march, it would seem that 1.7 miles per hour between Harper's Ferry and Boteler's Ford is a good pace considering the equipment the soldiers were carrying, the condition of the roads and the warm and humid weather. It also seems that the rate of speed would begin to decrease during the march as the troops became more exhausted. Regardless of the distance traveled, an eight hour march under the conditions that day is admirable.<br /><br />Regards,<br /><br />EdAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3202206756122982360.post-87637297318183915452009-09-06T00:38:30.336-04:002009-09-06T00:38:30.336-04:00Larry
Like John said, sometimes we hear something ...Larry<br />Like John said, sometimes we hear something so many times, we come to accept it as fact. This was the case here. I tried some different route combinations to come up with 17 miles and nothing worked out. Like you say, the bottom line is he got there when he did at the right place and time. Thanks for your post.<br /><br />JimJim Rosebrockhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16265389768045833247noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3202206756122982360.post-69627960030782825872009-09-06T00:33:23.342-04:002009-09-06T00:33:23.342-04:00Thanks John, I really wanted to be sure about the ...Thanks John, I really wanted to be sure about the distance but those numbers are how it works out. Hope to see you soon.<br /><br />JimJim Rosebrockhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16265389768045833247noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3202206756122982360.post-63804348882560177832009-09-05T20:16:56.919-04:002009-09-05T20:16:56.919-04:00It's amazing how some things get locked in sto...It's amazing how some things get locked in stone and we just accept them. I run into this all the time at that other battlefield. Good work Jim!<br /><br />John C. NicholasAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3202206756122982360.post-23093903888989299532009-09-05T10:43:55.876-04:002009-09-05T10:43:55.876-04:00Jim,
Excellent research! I wonder how Hill in the...Jim,<br /><br />Excellent research! I wonder how Hill in the first place estimated that he made a 17 mile march?<br /><br />As you point out, and Harsh surmised, there is no reasonable route Hill could have taken which would give 17 miles. It was just luck then that he arrived at the right time and right place to stop Burnside's advance which could have driven Lee out of Sharpsburg and put the ford in jeopardy.<br /><br />Larry FreiheitAnonymousnoreply@blogger.com